Topic: Spanish reporting who claimed harassment

[KoppoKick]

From what I know, I agree that it seems like Erin Andrews and people of her ilk go about their business differently than Ines. Ines is much more flirty from what I have seen on TV.

That doesn't absolve players from going all Charles Haley on her while she is trying to interview The Sanchize (not saying this occurred, but just saying.).

[BlackLight]

why would her "career" as a lockerroom reporter in men's sports be over?

I think many athletes of the alpha-male jackoff breed would resent her being in the lockerroom if she became the center of a long-running controversy like this. If she can't get access to these players because none of them will talk to her, it doesn't say much for her future employment prospects in that field. When your reporter can't get interviews with players because players are giving her the cold shoulder, then you need to consider getting a new reporter. Again, a harsh reality of the business, but still a reality.

[Pebble.2.0]

Dress like a skank and you will be treated accordingly.  Women can't have it both ways, they can't wear clothes that scream LOOK AT ME I'M HOT and then get mad when guys notice.  Don't get fake tits and have them out all the time if you don't want guys looking at them.  Don't wear pants with words on your ass if you don't want guys looking at your "juicy" ass.  

Female walks into a locker room where there are naked/toweled men dressed like that and is insulted that they noticed?  It isn't like they dry humped her, they just noticed and made some innocuous comments.  I'm pretty sure no one said "I'm going to take you out back and rape you", from what I heard it was more like "damn, I wish I was mexican".

Additionally, the fact that she immediately backed off her complaints only shows that even she didn't feel harassed.  By the way, how do you think the soccer stars in Mexico or Europe would react?  They are MUCH looser about sexuality over there, I highly doubt they would be even as tame as the Americans.

[A Very Smug Bear]

Why are female reporters allowed in men's locker rooms anyway??? Are male reporters allowed in women's locker rooms?

[BlackLight]

Why are female reporters allowed in men's locker rooms anyway??? Are male reporters allowed in women's locker rooms?

I believe so. Just not unfettered access.

[Solipsist]

That a female journalist be allowed into a male lockerroom without being the subject of lewd comments and sexual attention from football players is actually not an example of them receiving "special treatment." It's pretty much the exact opposite.

Uh, no. When guys act like guys in front of a woman that's equality. They're treating the woman like one of the guys. When you force a group of football players to alter their habits to accommodate an individual female journalist that is special treatment.

"Sorry guys, we like your primal, instinctual selves on the field but you gotta put that shit away when you're walking around professionally with your junk out in your bathroom... there's a lady present."

Which goes right back to WHY are there women in the MALE locker room? If you want to avoid a sexist shitstorm then ban all reporters and let the players shower and dress in peace.

And when you say "men are going to notice" a woman dressed like that, you're trying to pull the same sort of nonsense that Tom is - purposefully conflating the perception of more benign behaviors ('ogling,' 'noticing') with what ACTUALLY happened.

...

But what actually happened crosses into an entirely different sort of behavior.

Really, WhiteKnight?

The New York Post reported that during drills, Dennis Thurman, the team’s defensive backs coach, purposely overthrew passes that landed near Sainz on the sideline. The Post also reported that linebacker Jason Taylor volunteered to join the defensive backs. Players also reportedly made sexually suggestive comments in the locker room after practice.

Oh, man. I can't believe they did that!! They overthrew passes at her?!

A guy volunteered to play a different position during practice?!

They made sexually suggestive comments to her?!

Yeah, forgive me if I don't give two shits about the first two items there. As far as the third goes, again the way she dresses and acts DOES matter. Clothes do send out non-verbal messages. Exposed cleavage and tight ass jeans elicit certain comments. If you don't want them, don't dress for them.

Does that behavior rise to the gravity of rape? No. But don't act like there's no middle ground between the relatively harmless and sexual predation. There is a middle ground, and if we're to believe the initial reports, these Jets players crossed into it.

Welp, pack it in guys. Getting closer to an attractive woman or calling her "Bonita Senorita" is borderline sexual predation now.

[A Very Smug Bear]

If so, that's stupid.


Actually, nobody except players and staff should be allowed in the locker room. Do we really need to see a guy getting dressed while he's interviewed? Is it really that important to ask them about the game that quickly? Isn't that why they have the question and answer sessions after games? Fuck, I hate the media.

Anyway, you have to be a fucking idiot to walk into a men's locker room with 50 guys in it in pants that tight.

[Pebble.2.0]

She's only where she is because of her looks.  She intentionally uses those looks to get ahead in her career, she should have to face the downside of it as well.  This isn't like a pretty girl who is dressed modestly and is trying to get by on merits alone. 

[Chus-Kay]

why do reporters need access to players in the locker room?  can't they catch them outside? don't they have press conferences after games?  it seems ridiculous to me to be trying to shower and get dressed after a game and just basically chill out, and to be bothered by someone asking questions. 

[TH]

From what I know, I agree that it seems like Erin Andrews and people of her ilk go about their business differently than Ines. Ines is much more flirty from what I have seen on TV.

That doesn't absolve players from going all Charles Haley on her while she is trying to interview The Sanchize (not saying this occurred, but just saying.).

I'm pretty sure if they went Charles Haley on her, we would have heard about it.

[tdub]

man i'd burry my face so deep into that ass

[Little Jimmy]

This is the same chick who got carried off the field by Colts players after the superbowl. This is the same chick who did a story about which NFL player had the best pecks. This chick works for the same tv channel that sent another hot spanish reporter chick to the super bowl when the Patriots where playing wearing a wedding dress, who proceded to ask Tom Brady to marry her, and then wen't around calling herself "The REAL Mrs. Brady"..

My point is, not only does she use her body to her advantage, but it's supported by her tv station/company, if not out and out encouraged. If you don't want to get tazed, don't run out on to the field.. If you don't want to get sexually harrassed, don't wear pants that had to be spray painted on your body, with your tits hanging out, in to a locker room full of men who are currently competing in something which raises an already elevated testosterone level.

I fucking hate this country sometimes, nobody should be harrassed, but when does personal responsibility come in to play? When does common sense come in to play?

And like someone said above, it's not a double standard, it's preferential treatment. How many male reporters have access to a WNBA locker room while they're showering? There's a women's soccer league, I imagine there aren't any reporters trying to get an interview then.. College Basketball... The womens college softball championship makes it to ESPN and ESPN 2, send in Stuart Scott to get an interview, let's see the outcry for that. Won't happen.

[BlackLight]

I fucking hate this country sometimes, nobody should be harrassed, but when does personal responsibility come in to play? When does common sense come in to play?

Apparently not before you have multi-million dollar athletes behaving like boorish frat boys toward a credentialed reporter who, it hasn't been said, specifically invited this sort of attention, or appreciated it when it was given. Myself, I'd have thought it self-evident that 'personal responsibility' would be presumed before that sort of thing happened, but I guess not.

The simple fact is, you'd all be on much firmer arguing ground if you'd stick to "Whatever happened in that locker room just wasn't that bad." Now, you'd still have to explain why she was apparently uncomfortable enough with it to tweet (in real-time) about how uncomfortable she was, but at least you'd have her public retraction to fall back on and trumpet in your defense.

But instead, this other line of argument is, I'm sorry to say, profoundly insulting to both women and men. Or at least it should be. I don't care how tight her pants were. And I don't care that her TV station has a reputation for doing stupid pre-game stunts or just being publicity whores in general. At the moment it became clear that this attention being paid to her was unwanted/undesired, it should've stopped. That's the rule in an office setting. That's the rule in a bar. That's even the rule in a strip club. The expectations may be raised or lowered in each of those places, but the rule doesn't change, and everyday millions of men manage to function in these environments with something that approaches decency.

So why are football players given a pass here? You bring up their "testosterone level," like these guys are glorified lower primates, who let their hormones dictate their ethics, and who couldn't possibly have known any better. You seem to grant that Sainz was sexually harassed. Then you blame her for it. You actually write, "nobody should be harassed, but..."

I don't see the need for a qualifier here. I think most all of us would be comfortable agreeing with one absolute, or the other. 'Nobody should be harassed,' or 'She had it coming.' As I said, I think 'She had it coming' is a pretty disgusting sentiment, and one that's been used for decades (if not longer) to justify far worse behavior towards women. But at least, when you're not trying to qualify it, it's an honest statement. But granting that a wrong was committed, then blaming her for not showing 'personal responsibility,' while ignoring the people who you acknowledge wronged her, is very disturbing.

[Solipsist]

Now, you'd still have to explain why she was apparently uncomfortable enough with it to tweet (in real-time) about how uncomfortable she was, but at least you'd have her public retraction to fall back on and trumpet in your defense.

Funny you should mention that.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/ines-sainz-hottest-sports-reporter-double-standard-with-new-york-jets-091410

On Saturday, she went to Jets camp to interview quarterback Mark Sanchez. Apparently, players and coaches used a passing drill as an excuse to get close to her, or perhaps, to flirt. Later, in the locker room, Mexico’s hottest sports reporter found herself the object of catcalls.

“I am in the locker room of the Jets waiting for Mark Sanchez while trying not to look anywhere,” she tweeted, noting that she was “dying of embarrassment,” and had to “cover my ears.”

A reporter then tried to come to her aid, which, anyone who hasn’t been in a locker room should know, is an especially ballsy act. The Association for Women in Sports Media was contacted, presumably by the same reporter.

So, wait... Ines Sainz wasn't even the one who reported this? Someone else took it upon themself to be offended for her?


http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2010/09/13/2010-09-13_ines_sainz_mexican_sports_reporter_claiming_sexual_harassment_by_jets_uses_twitt.html

"I entered the locker room and there were some comments and some games," she said. "A colleague came up to me to apologize for what was happening, for the things that were going on, since obviously they were making jokes about me."

"It was simply a situation that got out of hand. I waited for the interview with Mark Sanchez, we did it and it turned out great...the next day the press is reporting that I was a victim of harassment and inappropriate behavior by the Jets," Sainz continued. "The owner, Mr. Johnson called me to apologize for his team’s behavior."

Despite the media frenzy that has ensued since Sainz complained of being bombarded by locker-room catcalls as she waited to interview quarterback Mark Sanchez, the reporter now maintains, "In no moment did I feel attacked or subjected to anything really offensive."

This changes everything. When I thought she made the complaint I thought she was a stupid attention whore, but now that I know it's some beta male trying to shamefully atone for the sins of his fellow man I'm ready to forgot about this whole thing entirely.

Congratulations, Ines Sainz, on not paying any attention to the dumb antics of football players and I wish you the best of luck in your career as Mexico’s Hottest Sports Reporter.™

And my condolences to this reporter and the people like him. Normally I'd finish with an insult, but they're too pathetic and depressing already.

[Little Jimmy]

At the moment it became clear that this attention being paid to her was unwanted/undesired, it should've stopped.

Your argument falls apart there in this instance, she didn't tell them anything, she tweeted about it while trying "not to look" at the players. She never told one of them that what they were doing was making her uncomfortable, but she told everyone attached to her twitter instead. It didn't become clear that it was unwanted until it was already done.

So why are football players given a pass here? You bring up their "testosterone level," like these guys are glorified lower primates, who let their hormones dictate their ethics, and who couldn't possibly have known any better. You seem to grant that Sainz was sexually harassed. Then you blame her for it. You actually write, "nobody should be harassed, but..."

I don't see the need for a qualifier here. I think most all of us would be comfortable agreeing with one absolute, or the other. 'Nobody should be harassed,' or 'She had it coming.'

There is no such thing as an absolute in this world. Nothing is completely black or white. I'm not giving the players a free pass, but I do believe a quantifier is in order. If you get injured because you got into a car with a drunk, it's a terrible thing that you got hurt.. at the same time, your injuries were avoidable if you had either not gotten into the car, or took your drunk friend's keys away. Her harrassment would have been avoided had she not taken that assignment and worn skin tight pants and a cleveage revealing shirt.. and maybe the outcry afterwards could have been avoided had she told the players that she was uncomfortable, instead of keeping it to herself and tweeting it. If after she made it clear that they were making her feel uncomfortable, and the players kept on doing it, then fry them all, and she has a leg to stand on. As it is, she's someone who has used her body to her advantage in the past, and works for a station that promotes it, the players already knew who she was from her past, and she's hot. And there is a different standard, I never said that they were not responsible at all.. But these are million dollar athletes who are used to being around hot chicks who want them, at the height of their testosterone level. They are not office workers, or 9 to 5 jobbers.. I don't expect them to act the same as you or I.

As I said, I think 'She had it coming' is a pretty disgusting sentiment

I never said she had it coming, there's a difference between saying somebody had something coming, and that someone should have expected something to happen. She wore skin tight clothes with that hot body and surrounded herself with self important testosterone filled men.

[BlackLight]

So, wait... Ines Sainz wasn't even the one who reported this? Someone else took it upon themself to be offended for her?

I never thought that Sainz had been the one to turn this into the story that it eventually became. I had assumed that one of her Twitter followers saw her tweets and did some sort of digging on their own, found out something, and told the press, who themselves did some digging, and then reported it.

Still have to explain the tweets, though. Without the tweets, I'd happily concede this as a case of one 3rd party reporter getting unduly offended by some good natured ribbing by Jets players towards Sainz. The 3rd party reporter (it doesn't say male, I'm betting it was a woman) calls the AWSM. It turns into a big story. But Sainz tells everyone a day later that it got blown out of proportion. And since we had never heard anything from her previously that contradicts that, everything is neatly tied up.

But we do have the tweets. And all Sainz has done is make new statements without doing anything to explain the old ones. Was she joking about "trying not to look anywhere" and "cover my ears" and "dying of embarrassment?" Was something lost in the translation? What she's saying now doesn't negate what she had tweeted before. But if she has a reasonable explanation, that would likely do the job.

Without that, I have to continue with my conclusion that she did this about-face so as not to face some sort of retribution from Jets players, other players around the league, or football fans who think she's some sort of trouble-making whore.

[BlackLight]

At the moment it became clear that this attention being paid to her was unwanted/undesired, it should've stopped.

Your argument falls apart there in this instance, she didn't tell them anything, she tweeted about it while trying "not to look" at the players. She never told one of them that what they were doing was making her uncomfortable, but she told everyone attached to her twitter instead. It didn't become clear that it was unwanted until it was already done.

Again - another example of holding football players to a depressingly lower behavioral and intellectual standard than every other human male on the planet. She also said she had to "cover her ears." Now, do we take it that she literally did this? I really don't know. But I *do* think there are such things as non-verbal cues. I don't make a habit of trying to act like a dirtbag around women, but I do think I can tell when they're uncomfortable in a given situation. If I'm acting however they were acting, and she's making a concerted effort to not look at me, that's a pretty clear indication that she's uncomfortable with whatever I'm doing. Now, are you really trying to say that the average NFL player can't make that distinction? That you need to use your words, or else it's all going to go right over their muscle-heads?

There is no such thing as an absolute in this world. Nothing is completely black or white. I'm not giving the players a free pass, but I do believe a quantifier is in order. If you get injured because you got into a car with a drunk, it's a terrible thing that you got hurt.. at the same time, your injuries were avoidable if you had either not gotten into the car, or took your drunk friend's keys away. Her harrassment would have been avoided had she not taken that assignment and worn skin tight pants and a cleveage revealing shirt.. and maybe the outcry afterwards could have been avoided had she told the players that she was uncomfortable, instead of keeping it to herself and tweeting it. If after she made it clear that they were making her feel uncomfortable, and the players kept on doing it, then fry them all, and she has a leg to stand on. As it is, she's someone who has used her body to her advantage in the past, and works for a station that promotes it, the players already knew who she was from her past, and she's hot. And there is a different standard, I never said that they were not responsible at all.. But these are million dollar athletes who are used to being around hot chicks who want them, at the height of their testosterone level. They are not office workers, or 9 to 5 jobbers.. I don't expect them to act the same as you or I.

Fine. I happen to think that this is a pretty dangerous attitude to have, and represents a step backwards in cultural attitudes that we ought not take. We shouldn't be forgiving these actions with loose social-scientific theories that assumes this sort of behavior is inevitable from millionaire athletes (and that we should just accept it unless we're willing to ban competitive sports altogether). I don't think judging a "biggest bicep" contest, and riding on the shoulders of football players after the Super Bowl are particularly strong examples of "using her body to her advantage." (And at any rate, she is still a married mother of 3.)

[ILTOA]

It's impossible for a girl with hips that slender to have an ass like that, right?  Butt implant, just creepy.

[Proud Virgin]

That a female journalist be allowed into a male lockerroom without being the subject of lewd comments and sexual attention from football players is actually not an example of them receiving "special treatment." It's pretty much the exact opposite.

Uh, no. When guys act like guys in front of a woman that's equality. They're treating the woman like one of the guys. When you force a group of football players to alter their habits to accommodate an individual female journalist that is special treatment.

"Sorry guys, we like your primal, instinctual selves on the field but you gotta put that shit away when you're walking around professionally with your junk out in your bathroom... there's a lady present."

Which goes right back to WHY are there women in the MALE locker room? If you want to avoid a sexist shitstorm then ban all reporters and let the players shower and dress in peace.

And when you say "men are going to notice" a woman dressed like that, you're trying to pull the same sort of nonsense that Tom is - purposefully conflating the perception of more benign behaviors ('ogling,' 'noticing') with what ACTUALLY happened.

...

But what actually happened crosses into an entirely different sort of behavior.

Really, WhiteKnight?

The New York Post reported that during drills, Dennis Thurman, the team’s defensive backs coach, purposely overthrew passes that landed near Sainz on the sideline. The Post also reported that linebacker Jason Taylor volunteered to join the defensive backs. Players also reportedly made sexually suggestive comments in the locker room after practice.

Oh, man. I can't believe they did that!! They overthrew passes at her?!

A guy volunteered to play a different position during practice?!

They made sexually suggestive comments to her?!

Yeah, forgive me if I don't give two shits about the first two items there. As far as the third goes, again the way she dresses and acts DOES matter. Clothes do send out non-verbal messages. Exposed cleavage and tight ass jeans elicit certain comments. If you don't want them, don't dress for them.

Does that behavior rise to the gravity of rape? No. But don't act like there's no middle ground between the relatively harmless and sexual predation. There is a middle ground, and if we're to believe the initial reports, these Jets players crossed into it.

Welp, pack it in guys. Getting closer to an attractive woman or calling her "Bonita Senorita" is borderline sexual predation now.

[FATSEXY]

Where's the part of the article where someone is forcing this brahd to be a reporter?

Erin Andrews is the obvious comparison, since she's a hot sideline reporter, but you never see Erin dressed unprofessionally and bet your ass that someone tried her early in her career. She either rolled with it, or she snapped on the guy and let everyone know that that stuff wouldn't fly with her.

Chick reporters have no business being in a man's locker room. Hell, no reporter needs to be in a locker room. Don't they do press conferences after games??

[FATSEXY]

PS - she's just a typical woman, using manipulation to get what she wants. She's now one of the most well known women sports reporters in the world. Scheming cunt.